Since we have covered the false alibi during the meal, the routine during the week leading up to Thursday 3rd May 2007, as well as showing that there is a high probability that something happened to Madeleine McCann between 6:30-7:00pm that same day, we are now going to look at what the group had agreed on regarding the baby listening and if the group actually followed what they had planned before they went and when they arrived.
We will go through the groups first and second statements and then compare what they said with their rogatory interviews.
The first three group members we will look at are Gerry McCann, Jane Tanner and Matthew Oldfield, as these three all gave their first statement at the same time.
Due to our findings that show the group have lied, we understand that the group had got their story “straight” regarding the Thursday night between 8:30-10:00pm, what the group didn’t think about in their first interviews is the other questions they would be asked regarding the times before, after and during the week.
The group forgot to discuss the minor details, and this shows in the groups first statements.
Gerry McCann gave his first statement on 4th May 2007 at 11:15am and stated the following regarding how often they checked the children.
Gerry McCann stated that himself and Kate McCann would check THEIR children every half an hour.
Gerry McCann did not state in his first statement anything about friends checking on their children during the week, apart from Matthew Oldfield in the Thursday night.
Jane Tanner then stated the following in her interview;
Jane Tanner stated that every 15 minutes a member from each apartment would go and check their own children.
This was different to what Gerry McCann had stated, as he had said every 30 minutes, whereas Jane Tanner has said every 15 minutes.
The way Jane Tanner has described it, is that every 15 minutes, 3 people would all leave the table (excluding the Payne’s) to check at their own apartment, and this happened every 15 minutes during their meal between 8:30pm until when the night ended.
This would mean the group would be doing 14 checks during the evening if they decided to stay out until midnight.
We then looked at Matthew Oldfield’s statement regarding how often these checks were done;
Matthew Oldfield has stated that randomly, ONE adult would go and check the children in the apartments.
This is completely different to what Gerry McCann and Jane Tanner have stated in their interviews.
The discrepancies we now have between the first three members of the group to give their statements are;
One adult went back to check all apartments.
A member from each couple went back to check their own apartments.
The checks were done every 30 minutes according to Gerry McCann.
The checks were done every 15 minutes according to Jane Tanner.
The checks were done randomly according to Matthew Oldfield.
Just from these first three statements, we can already see that there was no agreement on how they would look after the children during the meal.
This now puts doubts as to whether or not this is what happened during the week.
As none of them can currently agree on what they were doing, we do not believe they were doing these checks as they say at all during the week.
If this isn’t how they were doing their “baby listening” then what was the actual agreement between the group?
We will continue through the groups statements to see what other members have said.
Remember though, Gerry McCann, Jane Tanner and Matthew Oldfield all have their interviews at approximately 11:30am on the 4th May 2007. These three would now know what would be asked of the group, and before the next statement was given at 2:20pm, by Kate McCann, the group would have the opportunity to discuss what have been asked of them in their interviews.
Kate McCann gave her statement at 2:20pm on the 4th May 2007 and stated the following;
Kate McCann has agreed with Gerry McCann as she has also stated that every 30 minutes either herself or Gerry McCann went to check.
As we know that there was no agreement between the group from just the first three statements, Kate McCann says nearly exactly word for word with what Gerry McCann said in his statement. In our opinion, she has agreed to lie regarding the timings so her statement will agree with Gerry McCann’s as they would have had time to talk, and Gerry McCann was also present in Kate McCann’s interview. (As she was interviewed as a witness/victim, she was allowed to have her husband with her for support)
Kate McCann’s statement May agree with Gerry McCann’s but it still doesn’t agree with the other members who have already Day provided their statement.
David Payne was the next member to provide his statement on the 4th May 2007 at 2:45pm;
David Payne has now covered all areas what the previous members have said in their statements.
David Payne stated that members of the group went randomly, which agrees with Matthew Oldfield.
David Payne stated that they went every 20 minutes which has contradicted his previous sentence as he said randomly, but this now agreed a time between Gerry McCann’s and Jane Tanner’s times of every 30 minutes and every 15 minutes.
David Payne also stated that the members who went to check, went to check on their own children. This agrees with Gerry McCann’s and Jane Tanner’s statement, but it does not agree with Matthew Oldfield’s who said that one person went back and checked all apartments.
Rachael Oldfield and Fiona Payne did not discuss the routine for the checks during the meal in their first interviews, so we will continue with Dianne Webster, who gave hers at 8:45pm on the 4th May 2007.
As we have said previously, Dianne Webster has lied to give alibi’s to group members or agree with their story;
Dianne Webster stated that all the couples checked on a regular basis to ensure the children were okay.
This does not provide enough information to use for comparison, and it also covers all previous group members statements.
The final group member to give their first statement was Jane Tanner’s husband, Russell O’Brien. He provided his statement at 9:45pm in the 4th May 2007 and much later than anyone else. Russell O’Brien had an advantage of being able to speak to the entire group before his statement was given.
Russell O’Brien stated the following;
Russell O’Brien agreed with what Jane Tanner state’s in her first interview. That one person from each couple would check every 15 minutes. This ensure his and Jane Tanner’s childcare arrangements agreed.
So, after the groups first statements, we can already see major discrepancies of who went to check, if it was their own children or others, and what was the frequency of these checks.
In our opinion, this was not the arrangement the group used on holiday.
We will continue looking at the groups second statements and will compare them against their first statements.
Their second statements were given a week after their first, therefore the group have had time to discuss their timelines in more detail, rather than in their first statements, they had to concentrate on the written timeline between 8:30-10:00pm.
Gerry McCann was the first group member to give his second statement on the 10th May 2007 at 3:20pm;
Gerry McCann stated that the group had wanted the apartments close together as the resort did not offer a baby listening service, whereas he states the brochure said it was suppose to offer this service.
Gerry McCann did not know how this services worked as he had not used it before, but other group members have had access to it on previous holidays.
Gerry McCann has also stated that this was the first time David Payne had used a baby monitor during this holiday, which hadn’t ever used on previous holidays they had been on together.
Before we go Gerry McCann’s statement in more detail regarding the checks during their meals, we will continue looking at the groups agreement on their own baby listening service and will return to the checks during the week.
The next group member who discussed the baby listening was Matthew Oldfield;
Matthew Oldfield stated that the group were told there was no baby listening when booking their holiday, whereas Gerry McCann did not state that they were given this information before going, according to Gerry McCann, he assumed they had this service as the brochure had supposedly said it was provided.
Matthew Oldfield said that due to the lack of baby listening services, some of the group members reluctant to go to Portugal, especially Kate McCann because she had a bad feeling about the children of the group and the non-existent baby sitting services.
The resort did provide baby listening at a cost, but the group decided to not use this.
Due to the fact that some group members were reluctant to go, David Payne spoke to the resort to ensure the apartments were close together as they new the baby listening was not available before booking.
Matthew Oldfield also stated that the reason to have the apartments were so they could do the checking of their children. Even though in their first statements we now know there wasn’t an actual agreement in place during the holiday at all.
Matthew Oldfield was asked more detail about the groups own arrangements for checking the children during the meal;
Matthew Oldfield has now agreed with what Jane Tanner and Russell O’Brien had said in their first statements. Originally he had said that one member went back and checked all apartments, whereas now he is saying that one member from each couple went back and checked their own.
Even though this now agrees with Jane Tanner’s and Russell O’Briens first statements, it still creates a discrepancy against Gerry and Kate McCann’s routine of checking their own every 30 minutes.
Matthew Oldfield was then asked about his check in the Thursday night, and the reason for this check;
Matthew Oldfield has stated that him offering to check at the McCann’s on the Thursday went against the groups usual routine of checking their own apartments during the week.
Matthew Oldfield does not state that this was a usual thing the group did during the week (checking at other couples apartments).
As we have shown in previous posts, that the timeline on the Thursday between 8:30-10:00pm was a lie, Matthew Oldfield struggles to give the exact reason why they checked, whereas if they had been checking other couples apartments during the week, he would have said it was usual for the friends to check at the McCann’s.
Matthew Oldfield does not state that any other checks were done at other couples apartments during the week, and it was only the Thursday night they offered as he then felt more comfortable in entering their apartment.
So, from Matthew’s statements, we have an agreement with the other group members that one member from each couple checked every 15 minutes during the week, and on the Thursday night, he offered to check at the McCann’s.
There has not been one member of the group so far who had said they have checked at another couples apartment other than Matthew Oldfield checking at the McCann’s on the Thursday night.
Matthew Oldfield was also asked about whether he could see the apartment from the table in the Tapas bar;
Matthew Oldfield has now stated that the group could see the apartments from the restaurant, but it was a tenuous sight due to the distance and that their vision were impaired due the tarpaulin cover.
Matthew Oldfield has also stated that it would be possible for someone to enter the McCann’s apartment through the patio doors without being detected.
Apart from Matthew Oldfield’s supposed check on the Thursday night, through the patio doors, no other member of the group has spoke about anyone else entering the McCann’s during the week to check on behalf of the McCann’s, even though the patio door has been left open all week, and it was possible that someone could have gone in to the apartment undetected through this unlocked patio door, the McCann’s still said they left the patio door open for their checks.
Russell O’Brien was the next group member to give his second statement on the 11th May 2007 at 11:20am;
The group decided not to use the free service and arrange their own listening service.
Russell O’Brien stated that their own listening service would be that if a group member big or up sporadically to check at the apartments, they would also offer to listen at another couples apartment window to see if the children were crying.
Russell O’Brien also stated that only himself and Jane Tanner checked their own children, therefore the agreement to offer to check at someone else’s apartment didn’t apply to Jane Tanner’s or Russell O’Brien’s.
As we have already mentioned, not one group member have said that they checked at the McCann’s during the week, no-one checks at Russell O’Briens and Jane Tanner’s, apart from themselves, Matthew Oldfield only checked the McCann’s on the Thursday night and this was the first time he offered.
Before we continue with Russell O’Brien’s statement, we want to return back to Gerry McCann’s statement regarding the patio door.
In Gerry McCann’s second statement given on the 10th May 2007 at 3:20pm, he stated the following;
Gerry McCann had stated that THEY ALWAYS ENTERED THEIR APARTMENT AT NIGHT USING THE FRONT DOOR.
We believe this to be a major discrepancy when compared to what the group have previously said, that the patio was always unlocked.
If the patio was always unlocked during the week, why would Gerry McCann always use the front door of their apartment when it would have been easier to use the unlocked patio door.
We will now try to explain our beliefs regarding the patio door and this discrepancy.
What we know from the statements so far is that the patio door was supposedly left open at the McCann’s apartment to allow access for themselves and their friends to check on the McCann’s children.
So far, the only night the group have discussed about someone checking the McCann’s apartment was on the Thursday night when Matthew Oldfield supposedly checked, which he hadn’t done before.
No other group member had entered the McCann’s during the week, and according to Gerry McCann, they always used their front door of their apartment, even though the patio was left unlocked all week.
Also, in Gerry McCann’s first statement he said that he entered his apartment through the front door on his check at 9:05pm, and he also said Kate McCann used the front door on her 10:00pm check, whereas in his second statement, he changed what he had said previously and stated that they both used the patio door.
The reason for this confusion, in our opinion and from our findings, we believe Gerry McCann was lying to cover a lie he had told Kate McCann.
We do believe that the patio door was being left open for his friends to enter the apartment during the night, but we believe that Kate McCann was not aware of this arrangement.
Gerry and Kate McCann would leave their apartment during the night through the front door.
They would return after their meal and use the front door.
During this time, Kate McCann would not be aware that the patio door was being left open between the times they were away for their meal.
When Gerry McCann had to give his statement, he had to say he used the front door because Kate McCann would also probably say she used the front door, as that was their usual routine during the week.
This didn’t go to plan though, because once Kate McCann knew she had to lie and say that they had left the patio door open, she understood the logics and said she left and entered through the patio door on the Thursday night.
Gerry McCann than amended this in his second statement to using the patio to enter and exit, as Kate McCann now knew the truth of the patio door.
To summarise the patio door findings, Gerry McCann knew the patio door was being left open, whereas Kate McCann was not aware.
Some members of the group knew from the start that the patio door had been left unlocked at the McCann’s apartment and some group members only found out on the Thursday night. (We will be looking at these in further on in the post).
As we shown earlier, Matthew Oldfield stated that it was hard to see the apartment clearly and it was possible for someone to go in to the McCann’s apartment through the patio door undetected.
Rachael Oldfield also describes the view of the apartment from the Tapas restaurant;
Rachael Oldfield stated that she could not see the back of the apartment from the restaurant.
Dianna Webster also discusses the view of the apartment;
Dianne Webster has stated that it would be possible for people to enter the apartment through the patio door without being seen due to the angle and oilcloth effecting her view.
To summarise are findings so far and before we move on.
In our opinion, the group did not check at regular intervals of 15-30 minutes. We believe the Some of the group had a different agreement.
The patio door was Possibly being left open during the week unknown to Kate McCann and other group members, whereas Gerry McCann and some members knew.
There wasn’t a clear view of the McCann’s apartment from the Tapas restaurant, and it was possible for people to enter the McCann’s apartment undetected by going though the patio doors.
Before we finish part one, keep in mind that Gerry McCann had stated that they;
ALWAYS USED THE FRONT DOOR AT NIGHT
and that so far;
NO-ONE HAVE SAID THEY CHECKED AT THE MCCANN’S DURING THE WEEK other than the Thursday night.
Also, remember that Gerry McCann would have had to lie to Kate McCann about the patio door, but he also had to lie to the Portuguese authorities and this would cause extra pressure and quick thinking not to slip up one way or the other.
Before we go in to the rogatory interviews in the next post, only one member of the group spoke about entering the McCann’s apartment during the week other than the Thursday night.
This was Russell O’Brien who stated in his second statement given on the 11th May 2007 at 9:45pm;
Russell O’Brien stated when asked that he entered the McCann’s apartment through the patio doors. He does not remember if he was asked to go or if he went off his own back.
This was not the Thursday night as Russell O’Brien said he did not enter the McCann’s on the Thursday night, therefore, this means Russell O’Brien went in another night between Sunday to Wednesday.
Please click the link below to go to Part 23 - “Baby listening”, “Checks” and the Patio doors - Part 2
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